**Return as clean semantic HTML only:** ```html

About

In this powerful episode of the Resilient Pastor podcast, Glenn Packiam sits down with Ashley Island, co-lead pastor of Mars Hill Bible Church in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Ashley shares her remarkable vocational journey from corporate HR at Nestlé to high-level ministry leadership, navigating major church transitions, the aftermath of leadership upheaval at Willow Creek, a cross-country move, and stepping into co-leadership during the chaos of COVID. The conversation explores how to lead through turbulent transitions, the power of team leadership, and the spiritual practices that sustain pastors through uncertainty.

Listeners will gain practical wisdom on maintaining a clear “why,” practicing radical honesty with God, pointing people to God’s faithfulness in seasons of change, and the beauty of collaborative, diverse team leadership that reflects the heart of the Kingdom.

Key Takeaways

• A clear scriptural “why” grounded in John 2 (“Do whatever he tells you”) and Genesis 12 provides anchoring during major life and leadership transitions.
• Honesty before God through lament and gratitude held in tension is essential for emotional and spiritual resilience.
• In seasons of change, leaders must “warm up their pointer finger” — consistently pointing people to the faithfulness of God rather than human strategy alone.
• Team leadership dramatically reduces isolation, shares burdens, and allows leaders to admit when they “don’t have it all together.”
• Collaborative leadership creates space for vulnerability, mutual trust, and leveraging each other’s strengths — especially valuable in turbulent times.
• Diverse leadership teams (gender, ethnicity, gifting) modeled with mutuality and family culture reflect the unity and diversity of the Kingdom.
• Practices of prayer, community, gratitude, and honest conversation are vital for sustaining both leaders and their congregations through transition.

Highlights

• “Do whatever he tells you.” – The anchoring scripture that carried Ashley from the corporate world into vocational ministry.
• “Warm up your pointer finger.” – Ashley’s memorable leadership advice: stop pointing to yourself and point people to the faithfulness of God.
• “The burden is too heavy for me alone.” – Numbers 11 as a biblical case for the necessity of team leadership.
• “I don’t have to choose between honesty and gratitude. The call is to honesty before the Lord.”
• “We are trying to build family… a microcosm of what the larger Kingdom is meant to look like.”
• “Behold. Come behold with me the one who is faithful even though everything else might change.”

```