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About

In this episode of the Resilient Pastor podcast, host Glenn Packiam sits down with Jenny Wong Claville, Weekend Experience Pastor at National Community Church’s Northern Virginia campus. They explore the realities of multisite ministry, the shift from centralized to decentralized campus models, and the power of a team-based approach to church leadership. Jenny shares her unexpected journey from worship pastor to executive and teaching team roles, while addressing the pressures and myths surrounding celebrity pastors. Together, they offer practical wisdom on building relational trust, embracing diverse giftings, and resisting the temptation to carry the weight of ministry alone.

Whether you lead a multisite church, a single campus, or simply desire healthier team dynamics, this conversation delivers timely encouragement for pastors navigating the challenges of leading in a rapidly changing world.

Key Takeaways

• Multisite churches are moving from centralized “spider” models to decentralized, contextually aware approaches that better serve local communities.
• Relational equity and trust are more important than any system or model—regular connection prevents email misunderstandings and builds genuine collaboration.
• Diverse teams that include different Enneagram types, Myers-Briggs personalities, introverts, extroverts, and varied giftings reflect the Imago Dei and protect against blind spots.
• No pastor is called to be a celebrity or superhuman. Every leader needs co-laborers; even the most visible pastors rely on strong teams.
• Kingdom work prioritizes obedience, clarity of vision, and dependence on God over speed, efficiency, or personal empire-building.
• Worship leaders often develop instincts that transfer powerfully into broader pastoral roles because they learn to read the room and follow the Holy Spirit.

Highlights

• “If you don’t have relational equity, you really don’t have anything.”
• “We are trying to mirror a triune God that is in community with each other.”
• “I have hired people that are better than me in everything I do—and there’s a reason for that.”
• “You are not called to be a celebrity pastor. You are called to be where you are, in this season, for the one.”
• “The worst part of team is myself.” – Jenny Wong Claville (on the tension between efficiency and collaboration)
• Mark Batterson’s example of protecting time with the local church despite a national platform offers a powerful model against the celebrity pastor trap.

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