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About

In this powerful episode of the Resilient Pastor podcast, Glenn Packiam sits down with pastor, church planter, author, and speaker Faith Yuen Cho. Together they explore the transformative themes from her new book, Experiencing Friendship with God: How the Wilderness Draws Us Into His Presence. The conversation dives deep into how seasons of spiritual dryness, ministry wilderness, and even church planting disasters can become sacred spaces where we encounter the nearness of God. Faith shares vulnerably about losing everything during the 2020 pandemic while planting Mosaic Covenant Church, and how these trials taught her that God’s presence truly is enough.

This episode offers practical wisdom for pastors and church leaders navigating burnout, emotional numbness, or spiritual “blah” seasons. Listeners will discover how to move beyond experiential Christianity into a deeper, more sustainable friendship with God through awareness, gratitude, and simple acknowledgment of His presence in everyday life.

Key Takeaways

• The wilderness is not a sign of God’s rejection but an invitation into deeper intimacy and friendship with Him.
• God’s presence is enough—even when circumstances are painful, funding disappears, or emotions are absent.
• Experiencing God doesn’t always mean feeling mystical or emotional; it often begins with simple acknowledgment and gratitude.
• Ordinary intimacy with God (like mundane marriage) is just as real as passionate, high-intensity seasons.
• Gratitude is a powerful spiritual practice that shifts awareness and opens us to God’s presence in suffering.
• Pastors must normalize spiritual “Badlands” or dark-night seasons rather than assuming something is always wrong.
• Remaining with Jesus in the wilderness produces unseen fruitfulness that we cannot fully measure.
• A sacramental imagination helps us see God’s Spirit at work through all of life—not just dramatic moments.

Highlights

• “The presence of God really is enough.” — Faith’s central revelation while church planting in a pandemic after losing their team, funding, and building.
• “All it takes to experience the presence of God is to acknowledge Him in all your ways.”
• “We have to be careful: do we worship God, or do we worship our experiences of God?”
• “Just go to Him anyways… The mystery is God rolling out the red carpet to go deeper with Him.”
• Faith’s NICU story: learning to give thanks when her premature son was on a breathing tube and nothing was changing—yet encountering God’s presence powerfully.
• “Church planting taught me it’s a lot simpler than it feels. What ultimately built our church was hearing His voice and following it.”
• Beautiful balance between Pentecostal fire and contemplative awareness of God’s constant nearness.
• Practical encouragement that traffic jams, 3 a.m. feedings, and hospital rooms can become altars of God’s presence.

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