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About

In the season four finale of the Resilient Pastor podcast, hosts Glenn Packiam, Sharon Miller, and Rich Villodas reflect on powerful highlights from the season and engage in a rich conversation on spiritual formation, discipleship, and a rule of life. Joined by special guest John Mark Comer, they explore the difference between discipleship and spiritual formation, the importance of contemplative prayer, deep relationships, and suffering as pathways to transformation. This episode offers pastors and church leaders practical wisdom on slowing down, creating a working theory of change, and building cultures of discipleship that go far beyond Sunday services.

Whether you're wrestling with pastoral burnout, seeking deeper formation, or looking to equip your church with lasting spiritual practices, this conversation delivers timely, hope-filled insights grounded in Scripture, experience, and the latest Barna research on pastors.

Key Takeaways

• Spiritual formation and discipleship, while related, are not always interchangeable—discipleship often emphasizes relational pursuit of Jesus, while formation highlights the Holy Spirit’s transformative work through practices and community.
• Jess Connolly’s honest reflection on burnout—“I made exceptions for myself”—serves as a sobering and personally convicting reminder for leaders.
• The coherence of someone’s personal story reveals how deeply they have processed their experiences; this insight helps discern readiness and maturity.
• A working theory of change centered on contemplative prayer, deep relationships, and suffering is essential for lasting spiritual transformation.
• Creating a rule of life that includes rhythms of prayer, rest, renewal, relationships, and work helps pastors avoid cruise control and remain anchored to Jesus.
• Churches must move beyond Sunday-centric models and prioritize small, relational, practice-based discipleship to form people into the likeness of Christ.
• Slowing down, rejecting toxic metrics of success, and embracing suffering as a pathway to growth are vital for long-term resilience in ministry.

Highlights

• “I made exceptions for myself.” — Jess Connolly on how she experienced burnout despite knowing better.
• “You can tell how much someone has processed their story by how coherently they tell it.” — Rich Villodas
• “Most of the deepest transformation happens in Christian community around tables more than around stages.” — John Mark Comer
• “What you repeat is how you are formed.” — Sharon Miller
• “Slow down. Be patient. Don’t be enamored with Sunday or the big.” — John Mark Comer’s advice to his younger self and young pastors
• “We need a curriculum for Christlikeness.” — The heart behind Practicing the Way
• “Prayer is waiting for a word that we cannot give to ourselves.” — James Finley (quoted by Rich Villodas)

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